Let’s talk about feeling angry and sad. Bianca shares a memory of a classmate excluding her because of her skin color, and Dr. Lockhart and Nakita discuss how anger can cover sadness.
Let’s talk about feeling angry and sad. Bianca shares a memory of a classmate excluding her because of her skin color, and Dr. Lockhart and Nakita discuss how anger can cover sadness.
You can find out more about Dr. Lockhart and her practice online at anewdaysa.com and on Instagram at @dr.annlouise.lockhart.
You can find Nakita’s book, A Kids Book About Emotions and other kids' books about important topics at akidsco.com
If there’s an emotion you want to share for us to explore, send us a note at listen@akidspodcastabout.com. Check out other podcasts made for kids just like you by visiting akidsco.com.
Everyday Feels: A Kids Podcast About Emotions
S1 EP3, Bianca (Angry + Sad)
[INTRODUCTION]
Nakita: Hi, I'm Nakita Simpson.
Ann-Louise: And I'm Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart.
Nakita: I wrote a kid's book called A Kids Book About Emotions
Ann-Louise: and I help kids and grownups work through their emotions.
Nakita: And now we're making..
Ann-Louise: ...a podcast about them.
Nakita: This is Everyday Feels, a podcast about emotions for kids and their grownups.
This podcast is better together. Listen with a grownup, with a family member, with the class or with a friend. How are you feeling today, Dr. Lockhart?
Ann-Louise: I'm feeling really excited today because it's almost the weekend. I love weekends. So how about you? How are you feeling today?
Nakita: I'm actually feeling pretty excited too. Um, I have a lot of fun projects to do around the house and in my sketchbook.
And I'm so excited to try a couple of new paints that I just picked up. Ooh.
Ann-Louise: Well, thanks for sharing that. That sounds really exciting. And I think I appreciate that when we can actually have a dialogue about how we're feeling, rather than just going to the default. I'm fine. It's just nice to stop and listen to others and hear about their experiences from a genuine place.
So how about you? How are you feeling today?
Nakita: You know, Dr. Lockhart, I agree. Thinking about this episode, what do you do? When you feel an emotion that feels confusing.
Ann-Louise: Ooh, that is a great question. I don't like confusing emotions and sometimes I even avoid them at first. And then I try to talk to good friends to maybe help me figure out why that feeling is there.
Sometimes I maybe do other things to distract myself or to do something that's fun or enjoyable, like taking a walk or watching something. You know, but I think confusing emotions happen when we have more than one feeling at the same time. So Nikita, if you remember, in the first episode I talked about these ambivalent feelings, which are feeling, I talked about these ambivalent feelings, which is when we're feeling two emotions at the same time or about the same person.
So what about. What about you Nikita? What do you do when you have confusing feelings?
So how about you? How are you feeling today?
Nakita: Sometimes when I feel a confusing emotion, I really have to talk out loud to myself or I'll write it down so I can look back at it a little bit later.
So we're going to discuss one of the confusing feelings people experienced today. Are you ready?
Ann-Louise: I sure am.
[LISTENER MEMORY]
Nakita: I think it's time we heard from Bianca, from Ontario, Canada. Hey, that's where I'm from. Bianca has a story to share about feeling angry and sad. Bianca is six and a half years old. Let's listen to you.
Bianca: Yes, my name is Bianca. I’m 6 and a half years old. I live in Ontario, Canada. So who’s in my family is my mommy and my daddy. And who I live with is also my mommy and daddy.
Grownup: Wonderful! Can you tell us a little about a recent experience that you think about a lot, if you are comfortable sharing?
Bianca: Yes, um, there is a girl, and she said that only people with light skin can lie beside my friend named Issabella.
Grownup: Okay so what did she do?
Bianca: She treated me by her—by my skin color.
Grownup: Wow! Can you tell us a little bit more about where you were and how old you were when that happened?
Bianca: I was 4 years old when that happened, and I was in my school.
Grownup: You were in school, okay. And how did that make you feel, Bianca?
Bianca: Angry and sad.
Grownup: Angry and sad. I’m sure it did make you feel angry and sad. And, what did you do when that happened?
Bianca: I just walked away.
Grownup: When you do get angry and sad, what do you do to help with those big feelings?
Bianca: Well we have this little calming center that has a couch and uh, and some glitter jars, and some books. Um, there is glitter jars, some feeling emojis bookmarks, and um a breathing ball, and there’s also, um like crystals and essential oils.
Grownup: Yeah, that’s wonderful! And tell me a little bit about how you’re feeling about this now, cause you’re 6 and a half now, and it happened when you were 4, and I know you still remember it, so how do you feel about it now?
Bianca: Um, I feel okay about it.
Grownup: You feel okay. And how do you feel about your skin color?
Bianca: I love it so much!
Grownup: You love it so much! That’s wonderful!
And a little note from Bianca’s mom and how I dealt with the situation: So Bianca came home quite visibly upset that day. So we had a long conversation about what’s okay, and what’s not, and how people sometimes do see skin color, and what’s going on in the world, and how to navigate through that. We’ve talked about it quite a bit over the last two years. Right after the incident the next morning, I did speak to her teacher, because there were other kids of color in her class, and I wanted to make sure that the situation was avoided and didn’t happen to any other child.
And I also did run into that child’s mother, a few weeks later, and did approach her, uh, with butterflies in my stomach, and I did let her know about what happened. And the way that I approached it was that I said, ‘If my child had said this to someone, I would want to know so I’m telling her just so she knows.
So it all got resolved. It’s a topic that comes up quite a bit that we openly talk about. And I’m glad Bianca was able to share her experiences, and I hope it helps with other kids.
Nakita: Thanks Bianca. And Bianca's mom for sharing with us a memory about being angry and sad. And about being treated differently because of her skin color.
I understand how frustrating that can be. And how sad it feels to know that someone, you know, or even don't know can treat you differently because of the color of your skin.
Ann-Louise: Yeah. That's really tough because there's many reasons why people treat people differently and skin color is part of it. Hatred is part of it.
Not accepting people who are different from them as part of it, ignorance. There's a lot of different reasons for that. And it's hard because when you're a child, you don't fully understand why would people treat you differently simply because you look different from them.
Nakita: I agree. It's really tough and really confusing. Why don't we take a quick stretch break? We'll shake off those wiggles. We'll get comfortable and we'll get cozy. And when we come back, we'll talk about anger and sadness while we feel them and why they're so important to our everyday life.
We'll even give you listeners a chance to share a memory of being angry or sad and listen as others around you share their own memories of.
We'll continue after the short break.
[EXPLORING THE EMOTION]
Nakita: We just listened to Bianca who told us about how angry and sad she was when she was in school. And someone treated her differently based on the color of her skin. I know I've been there as a kid and as a grownup and it always brings up a lot of big feelings. What had happened.
Ann-Louise: Yeah. You know, that would bring up a bunch of mixed feelings for me too.
Bianca. Thanks so much for sharing your story, your experiences, and being so brave to share that with so many others, you know, Nikita it's okay to feel angry and sad when really confusing things happen. These things can trigger many other feelings within us. You know, as a kid, you're still learning about feelings and your brain is learning about what to do when you feel.
It's a lot to learn.
Nakita: You know, Dr. Lockhart, I'm wondering if there are other names used to describe the feeling of angry and sad.
Ann-Louise: Yeah, that's a great question. Nikita. There are definitely other words we can use to describe the emotion you’re feeling. And as we've talked about before in other episodes, these are called synonyms.
So other words for angry include upset, rage, frustrated, agitated, furious, and mad on the flip side.
Other words for sad include lonely, empty, depressed, hurt, irritable, disappointed, and even. They mean slightly different things, but they all describe different ways we feel angry and sad and what happens in our bodies when that happens.
Nakita: Hm. You know, I gotta be honest, Dr. Lockhart, sometimes it's hard for me to control what I feel inside when I get angry. Sometimes once I'm angry, everything else makes me so angry. And when I'm sad, the same thing happens. What's up with that?
Ann-Louise: Yeah. Nakita, you know, anger and sadness are actually close relatives. Anger is an excellent cover-up emotion.
Sadness is a vulnerable emotion. Sometimes we think anger will protect us from feeling things we don't want to feel, or maybe it helps us feel in control. When a situation feels out of control. So we think the anger we feel will help us feel less sad.
You want to know the truth though? It doesn't actually help us feel as sad.
Nakita: I remember feeling angry when I got the wrong order of food after going all the way back to my office. But honestly, I felt sad that it didn't get what I really wanted because the food I got wasn't as good as the original order. Oh,
Ann-Louise: That does sound like, oh, I remember, you know, feeling angry. When I was teaching my daughter history, we were at home during the pandemic. I was teaching her lessons and I was just starting to feel really impatient and I couldn't figure out why.
And I was even rushing her through it. And then I realized, I actually felt sad about the stuff she was learning. It felt heavy and it felt really uncomfortable. So the anger and the impatience was actually covering up the.
Nakita: That's so powerful to know how close anger and sadness are, and I never realized how close they are and how they impact each other.
You know what I think we should do? Why don't we give everyone listening the opportunity to share a memory with whomever they may be listening with when they felt angry and sad at the same time, or when they just felt angry or sad?
Ann-Louise: Nakita, I think that's a great idea. And what I would suggest is take your time, think about what you want to share.
Think about the memory, remember why you were angry or sad or both what you did and what you wished you had done differently. Maybe you write it down, draw it out, or share it with your. And if you were grown up and listening with your kid, take this time to listen, give them the space to share and provide comfort as needed.
There's no need to provide advice. Just listen for now. We'll give you more specific tools in a bit.
Nakita: All right. Here's where you can pause this podcast and share your angry or sad memory with whomever you're listening with. Take as much time as you need Dr. Lockhart, and I will be waiting right here for you when you're ready to come back
[REFLECTION BREAK]
Ann-Louise: Welcome back. We hope you had the opportunity to, maybe we hope you have the opportunity to maybe share by yourself or with your grownup. About a time you felt angry, sad, or both. And we hope that you felt heard and safe while sharing
Nakita: Dr. Lockhart, before I wrap up, are there any tools for. Angry or sad thoughts and feelings that you think would help our listeners and their grownups?
Ann-Louise: Absolutely Nikita. I have really, I've really, I have three really helpful tools and tips for each. So first, remember, your feelings are not your enemy, your feelings, give you messages about other people and the world around you. Embrace those feelings. Even the confusing ones. Second, when you feel angry, ask yourself, am I in the red zone?
Which means you're really angry. Am I in the yellow zone? Maybe you're just a little upset or am I in the green zone? That means you might be feeling calm and relaxed. You're just reading your body and learning. What is it that I'm feeling in the moment? Third stretch. Clench and relax your fists shrug and relax your shoulders.
Take three deep breaths in and then out you can do the same thing when you're feeling sad, too. It's okay to tell people what you need when you feel unsure or scared. But the bottom line is to know that your feelings give you messages and it's okay to remember that your feelings are things that give you messages and it's okay to feel them. And it's okay to communicate them.
[WRAP-UP]
Nakita: Thanks again to Bianca from Ontario, Canada, for sharing with us about how she felt when she experienced someone, treating her differently based on her skin color. And thanks to mom too, for talking with Bianca about it. And thank you, Dr. Lockhart for letting us remember and understand what angry and sad feel like sometimes at the same time and all the different words we can use to tell our grownups exactly how we feel.
Thanks for reminding us that our feelings give us information and that we are brave for sharing. Most importantly, thanks for reminding us that each of us are allowed to feel all the feelings you can tell a trusted grownup when you feel agitated.
Ann-Louise: Of course Nakita. I'm so glad to be here, talking with you about feelings. And to our listeners, if you want professional help and need to talk to someone about how you feel, you can find a therapist online by typing “child psychologist near me”.
You can look up all the different professionals in your area. That's a great place to start.
Nakita: And remember, you are the expert on your emotions.
Ann-Louise: Emotions are really your friend.
Nakita: And you're always allowed to feel what you feel.
Ann-Louise: Let's continue this journey together.
[CLOSING]
Nakita: Thanks for joining us today. You can find out more about Dr. Lockhart and her practice online anewdaysa.com and on Instagram at @dr.annlouise.lockhart. You can find my book, a kid's book about emotions and other kids' books about important topics at akidsco.com
Ann-Louise: Everyday Feels is written by Nakita Simpson and Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart. Our show is edited and produced by Matthew Winner with help from Chad Michael Snavely and the team at Sound On Studios. Our executive producer is Jelani Memory. And this show was brought to you by A Kids Podcast About.
If there’s an emotion you want to share for us to explore, send us a note at listen@akidspodcastabout.com. And check out other podcasts made for kids just like you by visiting akidsco.com.
Nakita: Until next time.
Ann-Louise: Bye for now.